‘Seance on a Wet Afternoon’ may fit here. I’m not sure if we have a hag (perhaps we have hagplay or hag wannabe) but we have madness and compulsion and an Attenborough.
In another corner of substack someone was complaining women had to settle for frogs and beasts, and men all got princesses and I thought, all the hags out there turning into maidens….sister, you just aren’t paying attention!
Re. loathly ladies: you made me think of the bit in The Black Cauldron when the bard gets turned into a frog and stuck between the witch's enormous boobs. Disney was different back then.
The Witcher 3 has a similar (but much more grotesque) trio of witches, who enjoy sexually harassing Geralt.
Wait Mother Fortuna from The Last Unicorn ain’t no crone like an Angela Lansbury crone.
She was also the unreliable maiden in Gaslight and while Eglantine in Bedknobs may have chosen a spinster’s life she had children thrust upon her by war so Ms. Lansbury can add embodiment of the triad to her accomplishments.
I adore Bedknobs and Broomsticks! In a way she is an anti-hag, she’s an older lady whom the hero falls in love with (even if at first he’s eyeing her up for a glamorous assistant…)
I had COMPLTELEY forgotten about that, now I’m having a rapid flashback of scenes from that film. The final sequence was absolutely traumatising. It’s so interesting how the type has survived and evolved.
Now that I'm "hag territory" (I'm 57), this "why we feel this need to make monsters of old women" is something I've noticed more and more. The "crazy, old cat lady" trope, the terrifying old witch, the hideous old woman (who's often in her 40s, heavens!).
Does it tie into the fear of aging (for women in particular, as society likes to remind us, we are old at 30)? Or is it the fear of women speaking their minds as they get older? I've been told by some coworkers that I'm "terrifying" because I just say what I think.
Excellent article, Rebekah! I've also recently seen "Eyes Without a Face" - so good!
Thanks so much, Sheila - honestly, I'm still recovering, it was incredible but wow *that* scene was such a tough watch.
I think you might be right about the fear of older women's confidence and wisdom. Interestingly though, Chaucer seems fond of his five-times married Wife of Bath who has had a colourful life, survived a violent husband, and tells one of the most interesting and complex tales about relationships between men and women.
I think that fear of women “speaking up” permeates much of the witch-hunting and other persecution of women over centuries. What’s that famous Margaret Atwood quote? “Men fear women will laugh at them. Women fear men will kill them.”
Such a great example! I haven't read the book but I wonder whether her character is more fleshed out there? I know there's more about the man and the guy with the bear costume...
I feel like Barbarian is much more sympathetic its its old terrifying woman; she's a prisoner, after all, and murdering everyone on sight is a pretty reasonable response to most of the men in this film.
I feel we must have an honourable mention for Minnie Castevet in Rosemary's Baby -- a very glam and gloriously assertive "hag" as played by the brilliant Ruth Gordon.
A really good example! Have you seen Eyes Without a Face, Dave? I watched it for the first time the other day (still traumatised) and I wonder whether the female villain in that counts? Stalking younger more beautiful woman to harvest their faces… Perhaps the glamor-hag is its own sub category!
Oh yes -- a very creepy film. (I've got a yen to watch it again now.) And have you seen Chrysalis (Leclercq, 2007), Rebekah? That's got strong notes of Eyes Without A Face.
If glam-hag is a thing, I guess Elizabeth Báthory is the reigning queen -- or countess, rather.
I think Eli Roth tried to do a Bathory thing in Hostel 2… she’s definitely a great example. I haven’t seen Chrysalis but will add it to my to watch list!
‘Seance on a Wet Afternoon’ may fit here. I’m not sure if we have a hag (perhaps we have hagplay or hag wannabe) but we have madness and compulsion and an Attenborough.
I haven't ever seen it but will add it to my watch list! I love the title...
In another corner of substack someone was complaining women had to settle for frogs and beasts, and men all got princesses and I thought, all the hags out there turning into maidens….sister, you just aren’t paying attention!
But I don’t like starting fights so I let it go.
Yes, the loathly lady is quite similar to the beastly bridegroom trope!
Re. loathly ladies: you made me think of the bit in The Black Cauldron when the bard gets turned into a frog and stuck between the witch's enormous boobs. Disney was different back then.
The Witcher 3 has a similar (but much more grotesque) trio of witches, who enjoy sexually harassing Geralt.
Agreed
Wait Mother Fortuna from The Last Unicorn ain’t no crone like an Angela Lansbury crone.
She was also the unreliable maiden in Gaslight and while Eglantine in Bedknobs may have chosen a spinster’s life she had children thrust upon her by war so Ms. Lansbury can add embodiment of the triad to her accomplishments.
I adore Bedknobs and Broomsticks! In a way she is an anti-hag, she’s an older lady whom the hero falls in love with (even if at first he’s eyeing her up for a glamorous assistant…)
I had COMPLTELEY forgotten about that, now I’m having a rapid flashback of scenes from that film. The final sequence was absolutely traumatising. It’s so interesting how the type has survived and evolved.
Now that I'm "hag territory" (I'm 57), this "why we feel this need to make monsters of old women" is something I've noticed more and more. The "crazy, old cat lady" trope, the terrifying old witch, the hideous old woman (who's often in her 40s, heavens!).
Does it tie into the fear of aging (for women in particular, as society likes to remind us, we are old at 30)? Or is it the fear of women speaking their minds as they get older? I've been told by some coworkers that I'm "terrifying" because I just say what I think.
Excellent article, Rebekah! I've also recently seen "Eyes Without a Face" - so good!
Thanks so much, Sheila - honestly, I'm still recovering, it was incredible but wow *that* scene was such a tough watch.
I think you might be right about the fear of older women's confidence and wisdom. Interestingly though, Chaucer seems fond of his five-times married Wife of Bath who has had a colourful life, survived a violent husband, and tells one of the most interesting and complex tales about relationships between men and women.
I think that fear of women “speaking up” permeates much of the witch-hunting and other persecution of women over centuries. What’s that famous Margaret Atwood quote? “Men fear women will laugh at them. Women fear men will kill them.”
Definitely!
I’m also reminded of the “what if a babe turned out to actually be… old?!?” switcheroo typified by The Shining bathroom scene.
Such a great example! I haven't read the book but I wonder whether her character is more fleshed out there? I know there's more about the man and the guy with the bear costume...
I feel like Barbarian is much more sympathetic its its old terrifying woman; she's a prisoner, after all, and murdering everyone on sight is a pretty reasonable response to most of the men in this film.
I think it had its cake and ate it, she was sympathetic but also so grotesque! The whole breastfeeding bit…
Hurrghh yep
I feel we must have an honourable mention for Minnie Castevet in Rosemary's Baby -- a very glam and gloriously assertive "hag" as played by the brilliant Ruth Gordon.
A really good example! Have you seen Eyes Without a Face, Dave? I watched it for the first time the other day (still traumatised) and I wonder whether the female villain in that counts? Stalking younger more beautiful woman to harvest their faces… Perhaps the glamor-hag is its own sub category!
Oh yes -- a very creepy film. (I've got a yen to watch it again now.) And have you seen Chrysalis (Leclercq, 2007), Rebekah? That's got strong notes of Eyes Without A Face.
If glam-hag is a thing, I guess Elizabeth Báthory is the reigning queen -- or countess, rather.
I think Eli Roth tried to do a Bathory thing in Hostel 2… she’s definitely a great example. I haven’t seen Chrysalis but will add it to my to watch list!